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 Rachel and Joey

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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Sun Sep 18, 2011 9:22 am

Yeah, he said they really bonded. It's so sweet. :) Have you noticed his voice, though? It's so much deeper. I wonder if it was always like that and he just changed it for Joey's character or if it just came with age. In any case, it's sexy, dammit.

Aah, you should watch Episodes! One of the creators is David Crane. It's hilarious, dramatic and (as far as I know) there's nothing else like it. Yeah, the fictional Matt is sort of an exaggerated version of the real Matt. Obviously, some details have been changed (he has two sons instead of a daughter and he's single, amongst others). So it's not like a biographical show or something. I'm really hoping we get a Friend guest-starring (crossing fingers for Jenny!).

I can't help but think that J/R would have started earlier and lasted if Ross and Rachel had never dated, but then, R/R is a big part of what kept Friends going. To quote Matt in Episodes, "Friends ran for 236 episodes. Do you think it'd have lasted that long if Rachel was a lesbian? [The producers] have to give the audience something to root for to keep them interested." (the whole lesbian thing makes sense in the episode context, btw) It's the only reason R/R was kept going for so long to the point of it becoming stale and repetitive. Numbers are important, and R/R kept the figures high, especially with the season finale cliffhangers we kept getting.

Yeah, I love how close the group was. It's nice how they could share kisses as goodbyes and not have it be a big deal.

IA, she did! It's quite a nice thing for a J/R fan to hear. Metaphorically speaking, there's no denying they were lobsters, made to be linked for life, but not as lovers. I just wish people had gotten that.

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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Thu Sep 22, 2011 6:45 pm

Hehe you guys are really getting me to the dark side! Sorry for my ignorance, but why "cobras"?

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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Thu Sep 22, 2011 11:45 pm

YESSSS. Reel him in, fellow Cobras.

It's this scene in TOW Rosita Dies.
Quote :
Joey: (sarcastic) Oh no this is devastating! My faith is shaken. I’m so glad I have the new chair to get my through this difficult time in my life.
Rachel: Uh-huh! Nice try, but you don’t get that chair anymore! All right? That is my chair now! You can sit on my lap! (Joey starts to get up.) No I take that back!
Chandler: I think I should get the chair!
(Rachel and Joey both laugh at that suggestion.)
Joey: How do you figure?
Chandler: Because you (Points to Joey) broke a chair and you (Points to Rachel) broke a chair! The only one around here that hasn’t broke a chair, is me!
Rachel: No-no-no! This chair’s not going anywhere.
Chandler: Well, where’s the logic in that?!
Rachel: The logic is, that there are two of us and we are both strong enough to break a chair in half!
Chandler: So Joey breaks my chair and I get nothing!
(Joey whispers in Rachel’s ear to confirm his response.)
Joey: That’s right!
Chandler: What are you guys? Like a gang or something?!
(They confer again.)
Joey: Yeah! We are!
(Rachel whispers in Joey’s ear.)
Rachel: We’re the Cobras!

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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Sat Sep 24, 2011 9:29 am

That is very sweet! I didn't notice his voice getting deeper when I first watched the series, but yeah, during my rewatch it got noticably deeper and more gravelly - I agree that it was sexy, though. Joey went through a lot of changes throughout the series. I thought it was a deliberate choice from the producers or makeup/wardrobe that Joey looked and sounded more boyish in the second half of S8, then he looked a lot more conventionally manly and his voice was deeper, especially starting in TOW Rachel's Dream.

I have heard good things about that show elsewhere, so maybe I will check it out sometime! Thanks for the recommendation :) If Jen ever guest stars (as some really exaggerated version of herself), I'd definitely watch it! Especially if she and Matt go on a spiel about how they (and everyone else) was hooking up behind the scenes, and they made out with each other while the other characters look uncomfortable.

I agree about R/R making the show run - to be honest, though, I think if the writers hadn't gone with R/R, they would've carried on their plan of Joey/Monica throughout Season 1, then possibly starting things forward with Chandler/Rachel in Season 2, since that's when they had entertained the idea with the flashback, but it was unsurprisingly not received very well (just like J/R wasn't in S9). I don't think Joey/Rachel crossed their minds until Season 5 because that's when they start having tons of interaction, but I do think there is a LOT of interesting retrospective 'foreshadowing' to J/R in the early seasons. That's a very good point about the show not lasting long if Rachel had been a lesbian. Joey would've approved of that, though!

Quote :
It's the only reason R/R was kept going for so long to the point of it becoming stale and repetitive.

LOL I so agree with this. When I liked them, I only really liked them together because of the cliffhangers and because I felt like I was supposed to expect them to end up together. Now I just think they got played out so many times that their schtick seemed tedious and not really all that genuine. The more I think about it, the more it sticks out as clunky fanservice rather than exploring why they would be good for each other. A world of yes to the lobster line, and what that should've meant in the show.

Glad to hear that Andy! I mean, it's okay if you ship both, R/R, or J/R! But it's nice to hear you're at least interested in them. I love that Cobra scene so much, especially that Rachel was the one who gave them that name.


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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Sat Sep 24, 2011 9:45 am

I didn't like Joey and Rachel... I guess that's just like they said in TOW Ross's Tan, when Joey asks Rachel why did it work with Monica and Chandler and not with them, and Rachel says "I guess they are not good friends as we are"... I think it would be more interesting seeing an relationship between Monica and Joey... But I'm also glad that Ross and Rachel didn't get married at the end but ended up together... for me, they will always be just dating.
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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Sat Sep 24, 2011 12:36 pm

myprecious wrote:
I have heard good things about that show elsewhere, so maybe I will check it out sometime! Thanks for the recommendation :) If Jen ever guest stars (as some really exaggerated version of herself), I'd definitely watch it! Especially if she and Matt go on a spiel about how they (and everyone else) was hooking up behind the scenes, and they made out with each other while the other characters look uncomfortable.
That would just make my year. I can picture Episodes!Matt just suddenly kissing her and making Sean and Beverly (the other main characters) uncomfortable. That Matt can probably be most accurately described as a smart Joey, so it could really work. Jen could be this really high-class woman. Sort of slutty and high-maintenance, but wise and sweet. They'd make a good couple. But this is all off-topic, there's an Episodes thread in the Matt LeBlanc forum.

myprecious wrote:
Quote :
It's the only reason R/R was kept going for so long to the point of it becoming stale and repetitive.

LOL I so agree with this. When I liked them, I only really liked them together because of the cliffhangers and because I felt like I was supposed to expect them to end up together. Now I just think they got played out so many times that their schtick seemed tedious and not really all that genuine. The more I think about it, the more it sticks out as clunky fanservice rather than exploring why they would be good for each other. A world of yes to the lobster line, and what that should've meant in the show.
They were forced on us, really. Then most people just fell in love with the geek/beauty love and I love the finale but I hate that Rachel gave up a job for him. Joey would have followed her there. I:

And i'mageller, this is a J/R appreciation thread. That said, it's both a friendship and relationship thread, so you can post about their friendship, just don't hate on the relationship.

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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Sun Sep 25, 2011 1:38 am

Oops, I didn't know there was an Episodes thread! Will post there after I start watching it. That's a great idea about Jen's character - I know she's busy, but I would love to see her in Matt's show! Matthew would be the next best thing for me.

IA that people really loved that trope, and I can see the appeal for it, it's just I just can't buy it for R/R anymore. They stopped working even long before the 'break' and I think they should've just stayed friends after really breaking up. Rachel and Joey were way more compatible and made each other happier, IMO. The only things I really like in the finale were the Joey and Chandler scenes, and knowing that Monica and Chandler got a happy ending. I agree that Joey would've gone there for her. It would've been the perfect timing for him! He didn't have an agent and it would've been a good idea for him to try a different acting gig. Joey, Rachel, and Emma in Paris is a wonderful idea!

Thank you for saying that last bit :)
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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Wed Sep 28, 2011 6:38 pm

SmellyCat wrote:
YESSSS. Reel him in, fellow Cobras.

It's this scene in TOW Rosita Dies.
Quote :
Joey: (sarcastic) Oh no this is devastating! My faith is shaken. I’m so glad I have the new chair to get my through this difficult time in my life.
Rachel: Uh-huh! Nice try, but you don’t get that chair anymore! All right? That is my chair now! You can sit on my lap! (Joey starts to get up.) No I take that back!
Chandler: I think I should get the chair!
(Rachel and Joey both laugh at that suggestion.)
Joey: How do you figure?
Chandler: Because you (Points to Joey) broke a chair and you (Points to Rachel) broke a chair! The only one around here that hasn’t broke a chair, is me!
Rachel: No-no-no! This chair’s not going anywhere.
Chandler: Well, where’s the logic in that?!
Rachel: The logic is, that there are two of us and we are both strong enough to break a chair in half!
Chandler: So Joey breaks my chair and I get nothing!
(Joey whispers in Rachel’s ear to confirm his response.)
Joey: That’s right!
Chandler: What are you guys? Like a gang or something?!
(They confer again.)
Joey: Yeah! We are!
(Rachel whispers in Joey’s ear.)
Rachel: We’re the Cobras!

I-am-stumped. I've never seen this scene before! shock I guess I have never watched this episode running on TV, only on DVD and there isn't this scene on it!!!

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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Thu Sep 29, 2011 3:58 am

I really, really, REALLY don't ship Joey and Rachel.
I love seeing Joey in love, I think is the most sweet and cute thing in the whole world. <3 But I definitly don't ship Rachel and Joey. I think it was way more cuter the way they realized that they are too good friends to be together as a couple, you know? It was so sweet that Joey couldn't have sex with her because of that.
It showed how beautiful and strong their friendship is.
I've always see them as best friends, maybe even brother and sister. So they couldn't work out for me.
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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Thu Sep 29, 2011 4:39 am

Quote :
I-am-stumped. I've never seen this scene before! I guess I have never watched this episode running on TV, only on DVD and there isn't this scene on it!!!

It was a cut scene, in the 15th anniversary DVD set! I love that scene so much.

Quote :
I love seeing Joey in love, I think is the most sweet and cute thing in the whole world. <3

I love that, too! I disagree with the rest of what you said, though. I still think Rachel and Joey were perfect for each other.

Another favorite J/R moment of mine:

Quote :
Joey: ... I already know who you're gonna go home with tonight.

Rachel: Who?

Joey: Me.

Rachel: What? Really?

Joey: ...Yeah, because we live together! It's a joke!

Rachel: Oh, oh! That's funny - I get it!

Joey: Gotcha! (they high five)

Rachel: You're funny, Joey. (Drains her glass).

- TOW The Soap Opera Party

Their chemistry was off the charts in that scene, and I love how Rachel played it off. The little noises Jen made and the way she downed her drink were all hilarious, yet at the same time I felt for Rachel (and my heart breaks for her at the end of the episode.)
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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Thu Sep 29, 2011 8:19 am

Personally, I don't buy that they couldn't have sex. The writers threw that in because hey, it's a convenient reason when they needed one to get back to the (incredibly forced and nonsensical) R/R finale. I like S2 R/R, but by S10 it made no sense for them to be together. It was demanded by the fans and there was zero build-up in that season, so other than it being Ross and Rachel therefore they're allowed this (in my head they broke up after a couple days), it was forced and random.

That said, I do like R/R, just keep it in the past where it belongs. "Sometimes, things have to fall apart to make way for better things."

Joey in love was one of the biggest reasons I started shipping R/J. Everything else came from that. I guess I have a thing for pining. It's what hooks me into most relationships, tbh.

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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Thu Sep 29, 2011 8:57 am

I don't see it that way. I just can't see them together.
And the whole Ross and Rachel thing... Everybody knew they were going to end up together. Most part of the time they wanted to get back together, but there were always something or someone in the way (and sometimes just their thought that the other one wasn't on "that place").

But even without considering Ross and Rachel, I was glad that it didn't work out for Joey and Rachel. That's not the reason I don't ship them romanticaly.
Rachel was never in love with Joey, it was only a crush and if they did have sex... I don't think it would go much further than that for her.

But I do agree that Joey in love is just the sweetest thing! He is really considerative of Rachel's feelings and the way he looked at her? Or the way he talked to her? Amazing.
But for me, it was a shame that he fell in love with her... I mean, I do LOVE the humor that all the Rachel/Joey thing provide (TOW Ross's fine, is just awesome!), but since I knew and didn't even want them to end up together, I feel sorry for Joey for "wasting" his perfect in love spirit with her.


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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Thu Sep 29, 2011 5:42 pm

Totally agree, Amy. R/R fell apart the second Rachel got the Bloomingdales job. The writers messed R/R up over and over again to keep up the drama and because fans wanted it so badly, but it became so predictable, annoying, and a bad joke by the end of the series (like "We were on a break" did.) I think the writers ruined R/R, and I agree that they only ruined J/R so they could force R/R together with very little build up, because they knew it was the 'safe' choice. If they'd worked at all on showing us why R/R were still good together, I would still like it, but to me they just became worse and more annoying people with each other.

Quote :
Rachel was never in love with Joey, it was only a crush and if they did have sex... I don't think it would go much further than that for her.

I think you've got a point there, but to me it would've been fair and right if Rachel had ended up falling in love with Joey. It took her more than 10 years to fall for Ross, so it could've happened with Joey. Also it seemed like Rachel fell in love with Ross within weeks in Season 2, mostly because he was with Julie, so I think it would've been viable for her to fall for Joey later. And in S5, it seemed like she fell out of love with Ross, then didn't think about him beyond lust or possibly dating him until the S10 finale, just so the R/R shippers would be happy. Rachel might not have been in love with Joey, but I think the possibility was definitely there, the writers just broke them up before she could fully return his feelings so it could never be a real threat to R/R fans. At the end of the day, though, I would've preferred it if Rachel had gone to Paris alone than end up with Ross or Joey. That way we can all decide for ourselves who she ended up with.

Quote :
I feel sorry for Joey for "wasting" his perfect in love spirit with her.

I don't think it was ever a waste, because he and Rachel ended up together - and she loved him in return - in my headcanon. It's funny, the more hate I see for J/R, the more I ship it :D
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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Fri Sep 30, 2011 12:22 am

Hahahah It's not hate, not at all. I just don't see it, really. =o
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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Fri Sep 30, 2011 1:03 am

I apologize for making that assumption of you, and I respect that you don't see it. At least we can agree that their friendship was awesome and the Joey arc in Season 8 was really sweet.

Here's an early Rachel/Joey moment I like: when she hugs him in TOW Joey Moves Out and says "Who's gonna eat all our food and tie up our phone lines?" before finding her bra. They were so cute in that scene! I also love it when Rachel is hugging him really tight in TOW Russ after he got all those negative play reviews.
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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Fri Sep 30, 2011 1:11 am

myprecious wrote:
I apologize for making that assumption of you, and I respect that you don't see it. At least we can agree that their friendship was awesome and the Joey arc in Season 8 was really sweet.

Here's an early Rachel/Joey moment I like: when she hugs him in TOW Joey Moves Out and says "Who's gonna eat all our food and tie up our phone lines?" before finding her bra. They were so cute in that scene! I also love it when Rachel is hugging him really tight in TOW Russ after he got all those negative play reviews.

There's no problem. xD And yes! I completely agree with you there! *-*
And that moment is really cute! Another one I love is when Rachel is moving back with Phoebe and he says that she was the hottest roomate he ever had. Hahaha The way he says that, her face after hearing it and their hug, I find really cute. Hahaha
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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Fri Sep 30, 2011 7:08 am

One thing that gets me about that line (about her being the hottest roommate he ever had) is how she even beats out Janine. We all know how much he wanted to date her the whole time she was living with him, and how happy he was when they did get together. I assume they did sleep together (which, correct me if I'm wrong, increases the hotness factor of a person), so it's pretty awesome that Rachel came out as the hottest without even having sex with him. That said, I imagine Rachel to be a very sexual person (the pineapple in A Perfect Fit, anyone?) so it'd just have added to her hotness if they'd slept together.

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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Fri Sep 30, 2011 9:36 am

That is true!
I never thought Janine was hot, she was waaaaaaaaaaaaay too skinny to my taste, so I completely agree with Joey that Rachel was the hottest roomate he ever had.
But anyway, Joey and the other guys seemed to see Janine as the supreme hot woman. And I was really happy when Joey said that because Janine was the first thing that came to my head as well. Hahahah
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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Fri Sep 30, 2011 10:49 am

IMO, her skinniness was justified by her being a dancer. :P

Yeah, Rachel didn't even have to do anything special and she still won a place as hottest roommate.

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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Fri Sep 30, 2011 2:04 pm

And Joey was right. Hahah Rachel is so much more beautiful and hot than Janine. I never really liked Janine, and after she talked about Mondler behind their back... Ugh.
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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Wed Oct 05, 2011 10:06 am

SmellyCat wrote:
One thing that gets me about that line (about her being the hottest roommate he ever had) is how she even beats out Janine. We all know how much he wanted to date her the whole time she was living with him, and how happy he was when they did get together. I assume they did sleep together (which, correct me if I'm wrong, increases the hotness factor of a person), so it's pretty awesome that Rachel came out as the hottest without even having sex with him. That said, I imagine Rachel to be a very sexual person (the pineapple in A Perfect Fit, anyone?) so it'd just have added to her hotness if they'd slept together.

Rachel Karen wrote:
That is true!
I never thought Janine was hot, she was waaaaaaaaaaaaay too skinny to my taste, so I completely agree with Joey that Rachel was the hottest roomate he ever had.
But anyway, Joey and the other guys seemed to see Janine as the supreme hot woman. And I was really happy when Joey said that because Janine was the first thing that came to my head as well. Hahahah

Janine was a pretty woman, but that's all for me. Rach and Mon (specially Monica!!!!) are far more atractive and sexy women for me. I guess Mon, for instance, is the kind of woman I would defenitely find hot, flert and fall in love with. My kinda girl for sure. I guess I'm just not like the other guys haha *weirdo

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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Sat Oct 08, 2011 8:17 am

Ooh, I love how Joey says that about Rachel! And I thought Janine was gorgeous, so that is saying a lot about Rachel.

The end scene of Rachel fawning over the crib and Joey saying, "Look, I know sometimes it'll be hard, but it'll also be really great," then Rachel saying, "I want me to stay, too" gets to me every time I watch it. The writers and actors knocked it out of the park with Joey and Rachel in Season 8.
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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Sat Oct 08, 2011 9:06 am

wow, when did this pairing become so popular? I can't really say I shipped them, but again, I never really shipped rachel with anyone. Even so, I find them so sweet together as friends it was almost like incest to see them together as a couple for an episode. My favorite joey & rachel moment is when he's reading little women and he's afraid if he keeps reading a character is gonna die, and rachel consoles him and puts the book in the fridge, dawww.
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PostSubject: Re: Rachel and Joey   Sat Oct 08, 2011 9:26 am

Ken Adams wrote:
[...] I find them so sweet together as friends it was almost like incest to see them together as a couple for an episode. [..]

I think so too. :D
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